Introduction. 

In 1997, I was attending a music festival in Osho Leela in Dorset. As part of the festival I was on the crew in the kitchen, so I was doing meal prep and also washing up. 

On one of the days, there was so much excitement, there were so many meditations, so much dancing, so much singing. It was amazing. But on one of the days, there was so much excitement because Deva and Miten were coming to do a concert, a performance. And everyone, a lot of people, had seen Miten plenty of times, but they hadn't seen Deva. And they were all really excited about it. 

And someone asked me, would I be going to the concert? And I said, "I'd love to, but we will be washing up the dishes at that time, from the dinner." And when we were washing up the dishes, a whole load of people came trooping in, there were so many of us in that kitchen and getting the dishes done in record time, we got them done so quickly because Miten had heard that the people in the kitchen would be doing the dishes and wouldn't be able to attend the concert and he said, everyone can come to the concert, so they're the people who are organising the whole music festival just made sure that so many people were in the kitchen to help us, and when we arrived at where the concert was being performed, we had the kitchen staff. 

Oh I'm gonna cry saying it. 

The kitchen staff had front row seats, and it was the most beautiful concert, it was devotional music. It just touched my heart greatly. 

And when I moved to the Northern Rivers of New South Wales, to the town called Mullumbimby. I started my catering business. I realised that Deva and Miten came to the Byron area every year for a few months, and they did do concerts. They also did their retreat and I just thought, 'oh wouldn't it be fabulous to cater for them ', and not long after that thought Deva contacted me and said, I've seen that you're doing, you know, home delivered foods. Can I order some. 

Yay. You can really manifest things everyone. 

Then I ended up catering on Deva and Miten's concert. And then I also catered at their retreat, which was a big highlight of my catering days, because their retreat had 270 people, and I catered it and just loved it, and just loved their work. 

And so it is just such a pleasure to be interviewing Deva. 

Deva is such a beautiful singer and also so down-to-earth and a really good advocate for eating plant-based foods. 

And when we did live in the same town, we often would bump into each other and talk about what food we were cooking or also talking about nutrition. 

So it's my absolute pleasure to be interviewing Deva, so that you can get some inspiration from what she shares about being someone who's famous on tour, and also living a vegan lifestyle. 

So yes, listen up. 

And for all the relevant show notes, you can head on over to www.veets.com.au/44. 

And if you haven't heard of Deva and Miten and you haven't heard of their music, I bet you once you do go to listen to it, you'll think, oh, I have heard that. 

Yeah, I've put the link in the show notes so that you can go over and listen to their music as well. I hope you enjoy this interview.

Interview

Veet

Welcome Deva, so wonderful to have you here. 

Deva

So nice to be with you — I've missed you. 

Veet

I've definitely missed you. The whole of Australia has missed you actually. So many people ask me, "Do you know if Deva's coming back?

Deva

Yes, we are — we're going back next year. 

Veet

That's exciting! Ah, I didn't know that — that is really exciting. 

Yes, yes, fabulous! You'll be well received here.

I thought I'd just start the interview... In the introduction I talked about your music, but I'd love you to talk a little bit about your music and the work you do through your music.

Deva

I've been singing and chanting with my beloved Miten for the last 35 years. 

I was going to say, ever since I can think, but basically since I left home, school and all that. 

And that's taken me around the planet and into the most beautiful life that I could never really have imagined. 

And took me to Australia. 

We spent, I think, 20 years in Australia, every summer for a few months. 

And so Australia has a huge place in my heart. But where we ended up living now is in Costa Rica. So this is where I am. You might hear the cicadas, you might hear the howler monkeys.

Veet

Right now? Oh, that would be exciting! 

Oh wow, it's amazing to have such different animals there.

Deva

Yeah, yeah. So we get woken up by the howler monkeys, every morning at 4.30/5 or something. Which is sweet for our ears! 

Veet

Are they louder than the kookaburras?

Deva

Oh, I think they're one of the loudest animals on the planet. 

No, they're hugely loud.

Veet 

I was going to move on to veganism... But I wondered if your music helped you move on towards being vegan, or what was your path to becoming vegan?

Deva

So I grew up a vegetarian. I never ate meat or fish in my life. My parents were vegetarian, no eggs also, but I ate eggs, my mom was somehow okay…

They were okay with us eating eggs as well, but even in the house I think we would maybe have a cake with egg allowed. She wouldn't make it herself, but we were okay. 

It was kind of okay to eat. And then I think I was 11 or 12 when I ate my first egg, you know, where it actually looked like an egg and I saw what I was eating, which was kind of exciting. 

But I never wanted it. I never wanted meat or fish. 

They really said, "You can have it if you want, but we just don't cook it for you." 

And I always thought: who knows, maybe I'm going to become a meat eater. And it was interesting because my sister, who grew up the same way, always said, "Oh, I'll always stay vegetarian." And she became a meat eater. 

And I never said it... and luckily I didn't, because that's what's so difficult, when you're addicted to something. Like meat, I think it's also an addiction. People are addicted to it.

To stop it is so difficult. And I was lucky that I just grew up without it, so I never missed anything. 

But then, as I was going through my life and really thinking about things, I just could never justify eating dairy and eggs and what is being done to the animals for us to eat these things.

I always tried, because I really liked all that stuff. And being German, you know, it's so much part of the culture... 

And then my mom was a really good cook and she would love cooking all this beautiful, not German food, but you know, very creamy and cheesy. Parmigiano, Pecorino all those nice things.

And I always thought I would miss that. I didn't want to somehow reject her food, because it was one way of her showing her love. And I didn't want to kind of make her adjust, so really, when she left her body in 2016, that was kind of oh, now we're free. 

Funny thing, but it really was like that. And I never really missed anything. I didn't miss Parmesan... 

Because it was 2016, so much had already happened that replaces all those things anyway. I don’t know how it would have been 20 years ago, but now I think — missing something is not an argument anymore, because you can have everything.

Veet

Yes, yes. 

So how was the transition for you from vegetarian cooking to, because I know you like to cook, from vegetarian cooking to vegan cooking? Was it an easy transition?

Deva

Oh yeah, I never cooked so much cheesy stuff anyway. 

I mean, it wasn't really a thing, no issue. 

Also, I don’t cook much. 

Now I cook a bit more, but I didn’t use to cook so much. 

But anyway, yeah, it was not an issue. 

On the road, you know, that’s the only reason, we are on the road so much. 

I remember touring in the early 2000s with a friend who was vegan while we were vegetarians.

I just saw her struggling on the road, when all you can get is a cheese sandwich. 

You didn't get anything vegan in airports. 

Now it’s a bit easier, but sometimes it’s still not. 

She was like a little reminder for me, you know, when you feel guilty that you’re not doing it, and someone else is, and you see, wow, it's possible. 

If she can do it, I can do it.

Veet 

Okay, there’s really no excuse. That’s great. Yeah.

So is it still hard now, on the road, when you go travelling these days?

Deva 

It depends on which country. 

Airports,  I mean, still often we go through Eastern European countries, everything is with cheese or butter. 

Nowadays though, the fashion is vegan. 

It never became vegetarian, it became immediately vegan. 

Veet

Yeah, that's a good thing. 

Deva

Even though it's not a fashion, I think it's here to stay, but what I see in Europe is, like, there's just so many vegan options. Even at the airport.

Yeah, and Happy Cow, the Happy Cow app has been amazing. How many beautiful restaurants we’ve discovered through Happy Cow!

Veet

That's fantastic and easy! 

Deva

Even in really small places, Happy Cow has listings. 

Veet

I don’t know if you’ve heard, but Billie Eilish made all her concerts vegan, so all the food sold at her last six concerts was vegan.

All the people attending the concerts had to eat vegan if they wanted to eat. Quite amazing that it's getting such coverage.

Do you enjoy cooking?

Deva

I enjoy cooking when it’s easy and when I have time. And often I do dhal or lentil soups or salads.  You know I have my few little things and I kind of pretty much stick to them. I don’t do a lot of exploration and recipes and stuff right now. I just like to cook a dhal or cook a soup and then have it for a few days, and each time we eat it again, I remaster it we call it, and that means I either add this or that or blend it or whatever, you know, like, just to make it taste a little different.

Veet

Recreate it. I still make your carrot salad that you told me. The carrot salad with the nutritional yeast and the tamari.

Deva

Yeah, you know what? I’ve gone totally, because I heard so much things about

nutritional yeast, that I don’t eat it anymore, so I’m not eating that one anymore.

Veet

Oh, that’s such a shame because it has, I mean, I could do a whole podcast on

nutritional yeast, but, you know, three teaspoons of nutritional yeast has enough B12 vitamin in it for our bodies.

Deva

That’s the thing everyone has their own little slant on what is healthy and what is

not and and in my opinion right now nutritional yeast is not healthy and

everybody is different, you know, thank you for reminding me of that salad. 

Veet

Even without the nutritional yeast it’s pretty yummy, so you can put seeds or something.

How does being vegan influence your work or vice versa?

Deva

When we go on tour, we have catering, and so we make that vegan, obviously. So our our band and crew, they have to eat vegan once a day. 

They are all not vegan or vegetarian, which sometimes is a little sad. 

I find it hard to understand. I understand that some people really feel they need to eat meat to feel healthy, but still that meat, it is difficult, you know, that sometimes for people that are very close to me, that they love meat so much.  Like, so much is a little difficult, but they’re all very respectful and sweet, and don’t eat it so much around us. I’m  a bit more easy, but Miten really doesn’t enjoy so much watching people eat meat, also, you know, just the aesthetics of that.

Veet

Yes I remember when I interviewed you, before Miten said that, he said he would meet friends for a walk or something, or do something different, rather than eat with them, and that is what I've done ever since he said that . I go for walks with my friends rather than go out to eat with them.

Deva

Or just take them to, we often take them to vegan restaurants, so they don’t have a

choice, you know, for meetings or band celebrations, it’s just a vegan restaurant. 

We’ve had beautiful food and they have  all said, oh this was really good, and we really enjoyed it, so they love it too, you know.

Veet

That is fabulous, yeah, there is a way. That is great to hear that, yeah, and I think you’ve already answered this but is there anything you miss now you are vegan.

Deva

No nothing, I can say.

Veet

Okay, and then just my last question is, do you have any advice for listeners who are wanting to add more vegan food into their diet.

Deva

What do you mean, like um any advice?

Veet

I have a lot of listeners who are not necessarily vegan, but they do actually want to start adding more vegan food into their diet, so I just wondered if there is anything that you could think of that could help them make those changes.

Deva

I mean, it is all about finding things you like to eat that satisfy everything, the nourishment and the taste buds and the preparation being fairly simple or whatever, or enjoyable, let’s say. It doesn’t have to be simple. 

So I think I once read this thing, that I think, everybody just has, like, four or five dishes they make or something, that it’s not like everybody has this huge, kind of, repertoire of things you know how to cook.  It is easy to do four or five things that are vegan, that could be part of your repertoire and and in that way you know just make that. 

(Miten walked into the room with a cup of tea for Deva)

Miten

So nice to see you so how are you doing?

Veet

I’m good.

Miten

You, yeah, you look great, you look very healthy.

Veet

Thank you, yes I’m super healthy, you too, you both look so healthy.

Miten 

We’re doing our best.

Deva to Miten

Do you have something to talk about, say about veganism?

Veet 

Just any advice. Yeah, we’re doing an interview on veganism for my podcast and I was just asking if you have any advice for listeners if they want to add more vegan food into their diet or they want to become vegan.

I’m putting you on the spot there.

Miten

I like it. It’s a personal thing. I think one that freed me up is the word vegan. I just don’t use that any more. 

I just feel like it’s, I don’t eat that, you know, but I don’t feel like I want to associate with, I’m a vegan, somehow. I totally applaud and follow that way. I haven't eaten anything like that for years now. And it’s  just so obvious right now, that there are so many substitutes that are actually better than the thing that we are substituting, like meat and stuff like that is much better than…. 

Deva

and chickpeas and chana and stuff it’s fantastic, we don’t we eat that fake stuff no.

Miten

I don’t like fake meat actually, personally I don’t  like it. You know, inspired by you, but Deva is such a great uh healer of food in the kitchen, she makes such beautiful food, yeah. I’m just, like, the old guy you know doing my best to support her now.

Miten

All right darling, lots of love. Nice to see you. Thank you. 

Veet

Yes, so lovely to see you.

I am so happy you are coming back to Australia. 

Miten

I’m looking forward to coming back and seeing it.

Deva

I think that is a really good point, what Miten said, that I always like to say I eat vegan rather than I am vegan, you know. It frees me up also, you know, and if it just makes it not so rigid and so arrogant, you know, sometimes we have to explain that we are vegan otherwise people don’t understand but yeah yeah but I ...

Veet

Yeah it is interesting, and it is not really identifying with it.

Deva

Yeah, and then it’s so easy to become a little bit judgemental of people who aren’t vegan, you know, so that’s what we have to be careful of. 

I can’t see it in any other way, but I am not one of those people who feel they really need meat. 

I have a friend, she’s an animal communicator, and she was vegan or vegetarian-vegan for a long time, and she really realised her body needed meat very very rarely, but it needed it to just to be healthy and strong, and when I talked with her about it, because it kind of shocked me, or I just didn’t understand it, because she’s so empathic towards animals. She said, you know, it’s just an idea that plants are lower in consciousness than animals, you know, and eating plants is also eating beings, you know, eating alive things that we basically kill, so I was like, wow, okay, I’d never thought of that, you know, so it’s really interesting different people’s perspective. 

Veet

But my argument for that would be, you’ve got to kill the plants to feed the animal, so why not just eat the plants, you know, because at least that’s one less thing that’s being killed.

So yeah, because the amount of, I mean, you would know, but the amount of grain that is needed to make one kilo of meat is like seven kilos. I don’t eat seven kilos of grain a week so that impact on the environment is huge, but, you know, I I love that you say that you’re not judgemental.

It’s very hard for people who choose this way of eating not to have judgement when we do see the cruelty. And so that’s something that I would love to get better at. And I think I am getting better at being less judgemental, because I just want to help people, if they do want to eat more plant-based food. I know not everyone is going to become vegan. Yes, I think you do a better job of that than I do. Thank you so much Deva.

I don’t know if there is anything more you want to say, but I have just really enjoyed interviewing you and hearing your

perspective on things.

Deva

Yeah, and what about the recipe?

Veet 

Oh yeah I forgot about that?

Deva

I’d like to share one thing basically.

One thing I want to say.

Tahini. 

Anything is better with tahini. 

So, for example, tofu scramble. I just realised, why doesn’t anybody put tahini in tofu scramble? It’s so much better. I don’t know, I’ve never seen it in tofu scramble recipes. Never, never. And then I make this such incredibly good chocolate mousse, kind of out of tofu and chocolate and tahini or tofu chocolate and congee, or sushi rice and tahini and maple syrup, you need some, what is it, silken tofu, you use, or the firm silken tofu, either just tofu chocolate and tahini and maple syrup, and salt, a little bit of salt, or sushi rice as congee, tofu chocolate and maple syrup. 

Veet

So you cook the sushi rice and make a congee and then add that to it? Oh that’s fascinating. So does that make it creamier?

Deva

It’s just a little different. It just tastes a little different when it’s tofu, then it’s maybe a bit more fluffy, a bit more, you know, but either way, super good. There is one recipe that is so simple, with red split lentils soaked for a few hours, and then in the vita mix with a little bit of salt, blend and then make pancakes, yeah, beautiful, so there's nothing else except red lentils not even cooked but soaked, and then blend it and then with a little salt, and then with some olive oil, like, pancakes or you can also put rice as well, soaked rice and lentils and then it's such an Indian thing, that they they would pound that in the mortar and pestle, but now we have the equipment to do that. You just make it the consistency of pancake batter, so you make it as runny as pancake batter, and it’s amazing, you could even probably put tahini in that, like, I can have tahini on everything. I would be like, some people say they could never give up meat, I could never give up tahini. Oh, I thought that, but I have not eaten tahini for two months now, because I was a bit addicted to it. Oh, okay, and I have tried it again and it is good to see that I can do without it too.

Veet

Tahini has so much calcium in it, so not that I have it every day, but it wouldn’t be a bad thing if you did have it every day for the calcium.

Deva

and then the other thing is, my breakfast is, miso and um, well, like white miso, not that really strong, like, the more light color, white miso, and fresh turmeric, fresh ginger, a little bit of pepper, because of the turmeric, and then maybe add tofu, silken tofu, and then that’s very beautiful warm and creamy. You can also put tahini, like, a little spoonful of tahini in there. Really beautiful, creamy, fresh, because of the turmeric, it tastes fresh, nice, kind of thing. It’s really nice.

Veet

It’s really good to have something with liquid for breakfast. 

Deva 

And something salty for breakfast.

Veet

Going back to the scrambled tofu. How much tahini do you put in it?

Deva

Just like, um, like, a spoonful, like, a tablespoon for 400 grams of tofu.

Veet 

I’m going to definitely try that.

Deva

It just kind of puts it all together, just glues it all together in a nice way.

Veet

Yeah, lovely. 

Thank you so much. That is so many recipes. Thank you, Deva. Thank you. 

I just, yeah, I am so excited that you are coming back to Australia, and I will let my listeners know when you are coming back, so they can come to your concert. 

Deva

Yeah. In October. In October. 

Veet

Thank you so much, Deva, for the interview

Deva 

And I give my love to my Mak, and I look forward to seeing you.

Veet

Wow, I just loved doing that interview with Deva, and it was a real treat to have Miten pop in as well. I hope you enjoyed listening to this interview. There is lots and lots to ponder on, actually.

Future podcasts are going to come out of some of the things that we talked about, like whether nutritional yeast is good or not for you, and the, you know, plants, eating plants versus animals, and all sorts of things in there. So there is lots of food for thought in there (that was a pun that was intended).

Anyway, I am super excited to be sharing this interview with you, and with Deva’s permission, I am going to be playing one of her chants at the end of this interview, so that’s really exciting! 

If you haven’t heard of Deva and Miten head on over to their music- link above.

Much, much love to you, wonderful listener. 

I hope you have a deliciously

wonderful day.

Until next week I hope you eat a whole lot of delicious vegan food.