Introduction 

We all remember 2020 and 2021, where we seemed to be in constant lockdown and it was so difficult to do anything, especially if it was face-to-face. I managed to run a very small vegan chef training. It was a feat, but we managed to find a five-week window where there weren't any lockdowns. Two people graduated from the training and it was wonderful. The graduation was incredible and today I have one of those graduates on this podcast. It's the beautiful Jessika Dawn who lives out at Stanthorpe and has a tempeh making business and I can't wait to share this interview with you. 

Veet 

Welcome, Jesika. So lovely to have you here. In the intro, I talked about how you're making tempeh and that's really exciting. So I'd like to talk about that, but I'm just going to ask you a few questions about prior to you starting to make tempeh. When you graduated from the vegan chef training in 2021, did you know that you'd have a tempeh making business? 

Jesika 

No, no, not at all. No. I was at that point, I was just at a crossroads. I knew that I had just done a permaculture design certificate. And then I knew the vegan chef training would lead to something, I didn't know what, I just thought it might happen a little sooner though. 

Veet

When did you start making tempeh? 

Jesika

I started making tempeh only last year. It was about a year ago now. Sorry, I'm just trying to do the work.  However it was just me trying to work out things before I started selling. One of the things I worked out was that I needed to label things properly, because you have a starter when you're making the tempeh and I hadn't labelled it. You keep the starter in your freezer and my tempeh wasn't working. And I was like, what am I doing wrong? I don't know what I'm doing wrong. I bought a new starter and I moved on anyway. It was about two months later, I woke up in the middle of the night and I was like. Oh my God, I was using onion powder. So I think we've already done the fun cooking tip. Oh yeah. That's it. Label everything in the kitchen. Especially things that look similar. Yeah. Cause apparently, tempeh won't work with onion powder. Who'd have thought, ha ha.  

Veet

That's so funny. I think we've all made mistakes like that. 

How did the vegan chef training help you in establishing your tempeh making business, even though you graduated a few years before you started? 

Jesika

It was actually pretty much invaluable. I wouldn't be here without it, if I hadn't done it. There was confidence building, that was definitely a huge part of the vegan chef training. But there's also, because it was the chef training, there was, like, the professionalism. So the professionalism of how to start a business, how to run a kitchen, understanding of food safety, things like that. And then all of the cooking skills and techniques. But I think the main thing is that I wouldn't be here without doing it because it wouldn't have occurred to me that I could create a business around making a product. That was an aspect in the business module. And I was like, oh, that's it. That's what I can do. So yeah, it was pretty much invaluable. 

Veet

That's great. So you knew that after the Vegan Chef Training, you wanted to make a product, but what brought you around to deciding it was going to be tempeh? 

Jesika

Well, interesting. Yeah, so I thought it was going to be more, I was working on a whole lot of recipes for cakes. Not fancy cakes, just like loaf cakes, good, stodgy, yummy loaf cakes. And Bikkies and Slices and I thought I would be on-selling them to cafes. And then when we moved to Stanthorpe. I thought that I would, you know, maybe even have that set-up at the local farmer's market or something. So that was what I thought I would be doing. And then, when I had my first fresh, homemade tempeh, I was like, Oh my God, the world needs this more. Yes. This is far more important. So I might, you know, circle back around to including the other products. But at the moment I'm just trying to focus on the tempeh. 

Veet

And actually the world needs Jesika's tempeh. It's so good. It's so good. I have to say I love it.  There's lots of great tempeh makers but to be honest, it's my favourite.

Jesika 

Oh, that's so good to know. It is so good. 

Veet

We're already talking about tempeh. I'm so excited about tempeh because I know a lot of people don't actually like tempeh, or they don't acquire the taste for tempeh. But it is such an incredible product to be eating, especially on a vegan diet. And there are all sorts of ways of making it taste amazing. And yeah, could you talk about what tempeh is? 

Jesika

Yeah. It is, in a nutshell, a fermented bean cake. So traditionally, it's with soybeans. It originated in Java, a long time ago.  Traditionally, it is made with soybeans, but you can also make it with seeds, grains or other legumes. And basically you prepare the grain, the legume or the seed, and then you inoculate it with the Rhizophos spore, which is a starter, and then you have to incubate it

And what happens is that the bacteria or mycelium, it grows over the whole cake, over and all through, it binds it all together. So you've got this sort of fluffy, white coating on it. And it does amazing things while it's doing that. So health-wise, it's doing a lot of work for us, with pre-digesting things and sort of making a lot of vitamins and minerals bioavailable. Yeah, it is pretty interesting. It gets lumped in with tofu a lot, but it's actually very different. The process is different, the results are different. I think it gets lumped in because it can be cooked very similarl. And also because it's made of soy, but  tofu is not fermented and tempeh is. 

Veet

You people are making it with other things other than soy. You have mentioned a little bit about why to include it in our diet and it's definitely good for the gut microbiome, because it's a fermented food. And we do know that we should be having three to six servings of fermented foods a day, to improve our gut microbiome. Is there anything else you wanted to add about why we should be putting tempeh in our diet? 

Jesika 

Well, it's delicious. I think that's the main reason. Yes, it is very delicious. But there's also some studies that have been done that show it's got a lot of B12 in it as well. And I've read a few things saying that, unlike miso, its not high in sodium.  So you don't have that happening with tempeh. Yeah, there's been indications that it could lower cholesterol. But my experience, which is not scientific at all, is that the people I've been checking in with regularly, who are getting tempeh from me, they just feel good. Yeah, absolutely. It's not a scientific thing to say at all, but you just feel really good when you're eating it. 

Veet

And I always forget about the B12, but you do have to be buying the unpasteurized tempeh. Some of the tempeh that you get in the supermarkets is going to be pasteurized. It is a brilliant source of B12 and non-vegans will often say, yes, but the B12 disappears when it's cooked. But that's not actually true, because you get B12 from meat when it's cooked and you get B12 from tempeh when it's cooked as well. 

Jesika

I keep forgetting about that, with the pasteurization as well, because I'm not pasteurizing the stuff I'm making. And so yeah, there is a difference. Yeah. 

Veet

And in the studies on K2, because we need vitamin K2 for our bone health, they haven't done any studies with tempeh. But I'm sure when people start studying that more, that tempeh is going to have a lot of K2 in it as well. So it's very important to include it for your bone health.

Some people don't like tempeh, and my partner, Mak was one of those people , but he loves your tempeh. 

Jesika

Oh, I'm so glad to hear that. But also since he's been vegan.

Veet

He has acquired a taste for it more, but you know, a lot of my listeners, I know you're not vegan, but you may want to be adding tempeh into your diet because it is so healthy. So what advice do you have, Jesika, on what to do with tempeh when people don't like it? 

Jesika

I think, and this is just very much to do with your location, but if you can source local, unpasteurised tempeh, it's really worth trying that, because it does have a very different flavour. If you don't have that and you do only have access to the commercially... pasteurised, then use that. Otherwise, you can try and find some in health food stores. There are small-batch made ones, and sometimes they are frozen. They may or may not pasteurise them, but they've got a bit of a better flavour than what's in the big supermarkets. I haven't done this because I'm making my own, but I have read that if you steam tempeh beforehand, you can open it up to accept the flavours that you're going to use when you marinate it. 

So that's an option. And if all of that is still, you know, not working, I would suggest to Google vegan tempeh breakfast sausages, because I have just made those recently, and you are building this amazing flavour profile with all of the spices and everything that you add in. But you're also making a little rissole. So you're taking away texture, because it depends what you're not liking. If you're not liking the taste or if you're not liking the texture, I think the vegan sausages, tempeh sausages, sort of cover both of those. 

Veet 

Oh yeah, that's great. That reminds me in my cookbook there's the vegan tempeh cakes, which I had in Bali. You're either crumbling or processing the tempeh in the food processor and then you're adding the flavour of the kaffir lime and the tamari, onion and garlic, and then you make these little patties from them. I've had people not know it was tempeh. 

Yeah. It just becomes this like yummy flavour bomb. And if you remember, Jesika was, for a long time, the assistant teacher in the vegan foundation course when I was running it in-person, and we had somebody come along who said, I would love to be able to like tempeh, but I've tried it every way and I don't think it's possible to like it. And then we marinated it in tamari, a little bit of maple syrup, some oil and smoked paprika, and then oven-baked it, and she loved it. 

And one thing. I know I'm interviewing you and I am now doing all the talking, but I'm so excited by tempeh. What I do quickly for lunch for Mak and I, is, I just fry it up with a little bit of toasted sesame oil and then some tamari too, it is great to 

Jesika what's your favourite way of eating tempeh? 

Jesika

Well, again, it's the tempeh that I'm making. So it comes with a lot of its own flavour. And basically, I just cut it up into cubes or strips, fry it in organic sunflower oil with salt and pepper, and then add it to whatever I'm eating. And I usually eat a lot of it just on its own, before it makes it into the meal. But yeah, it just can be really simple. Before I was making my own tempeh, I would marinate it and bake it a lot. But now I just can't get enough out of it, just frying it and eating it. 

Veet

I know someone told me to grate it and then put it in a bolognese. And I have exciting news, because Jesika is actually teaching tempeh on the vegan chef training. We haven't had tempeh making on the vegan chef training for some years. So this year, as part of the group training, Jesika will be teaching tempeh. And then the world can eat homemade tempeh. Yes, and if you're thinking, I want Jesika's tempeh, you're going to have to learn how to make it yourself because Jesika, you're not producing it for mass production, are you?

Jesika 

 I am not, no.  So part of my business model is that it's made weekly and it's local. So you have to come to Stanthorpe and you have to let me know that you want it by Wednesday night. I don't want to pasteurize it. I don't even want to freeze it. You can freeze it and, you know, I think that's fine. But ideally, I just want to make it and eat it. 

Veet

Yes, so sticking with the local, you know, not having all the food miles on a product, but there is a way you can eat Jesika's tempeh to learn from her how to make it. Can you tell us what your business name is though? Because this is such a lovely name.

Jesika 

It is Tickle Chew. And the idea behind that is it's joyful eating happy food, you know, just makes you want to smile. And it's fun to say.

Veet 

And if you could see us now, we're smiling as we're talking about Tickle chew. And I know you've already shared your recipe, but was that your recipe, or do you have a recipe to share with us.

Jesika 

I do have one basically, I sort of have two recipes to share, you could say.

 It's just a block of tempeh that you cut into strips. And then that's just fried in organic sunflower oil with salt and pepper and you set that aside. Then, you saute sliced leek, sliced cabbage, and sliced mushrooms. Put all that together. You can add a little salt and pepper to that, but all of those things come with very yummy flavours anyway. And then for this one, I did make a dressing, it's like a sesame dressing. I'll just read that out. it's inspired from a cookbook 'To Asia with Love', but it's just;

three tablespoons of apple cider vinegar

2 tablespoons of rapadura sugar 

1 tablespoon of tamari

 1 clove of garlic that's minced

1 tablespoon of toasted sesame oil

3 tablespoons of olive oil

and some salt and pepper 

You just mix all that up and then you have some noodles, I use udon, and I mix that dressing through the udon, and then mix the sautéed vegetables through, and then just sprinkle the top with the tempeh and some sesame seeds and some slithered almonds. 

Veet

Oh, yum. Oh, you're making me hungry. And I don't have any more of your tempeh left. 

Jesika

Time to come to Stanthorpe. The other one is a variation on that as well. So it's just the idea that you just have to fry your tempeh, that's your complete protein, sauté up some seasonal vegetables and you can have a sauce with it or not. And then I always like to put some nuts, just because I like the crunch. I sprinkle a little bit of tamari or homemade Worcestershire sauce on the tempeh when I am frying it, which I learned from the vegan chef training. That's always in the fridge. 

And then that one I did with silverbeet, mushroom and the shallots. You know, the little French ones. They're delicious, that sweet flavour, and then add some thyme. That one I sometimes will put on rice and sprinkle with chopped walnuts. 

Veet

Oh, that sounds divine. I can't believe you're still making the Worcestershire sauce. That's awesome.

Jesika

Oh, yeah, there's heaps of things that I'm still making from the vegan chef training . 

Veet

Do you have a fun cooking tip to share with us? 

Jesika

Well, I did. It was about labelling, but I would highly recommend labelling when storing things in jars, etc.

Yeah. And the fun cooking tip, I guess, was, I did sort of mention it. It's well, I actually had two of those. So it was just to say again, if you can only get that commercial tempeh, just steam it first and then marinate it, and it'll accept the flavours a lot better. But the other one that I've found, sort of, anyway, is when you're frying tempeh, you sprinkle a little of the Chinese five spice on. And it's a really subtle flavour., 

Veet 

That's lovely. I'm going to try that. Thank you so much, Jesika, for telling us all about Tempeh. 

Jesika

My pleasure. Yeah, it was wonderful having a chat with you. Thank you. Thank you. Bye. Bye. 

Veet

Wasn't that a wonderful interview with Jesika? If you could have seen us, you would see that, the whole time we were smiling because tempeh just makes you smile when you get the love of tempeh, it just lights your whole life up.  I know that sounds a bit extreme, but it does, it just really makes you feel good when you're eating it!

Have a sensational day and until next time, bye!